tv Greta Van Susteren FOX News August 16, 2013 7:00pm-8:01pm PDT
>> all right. great one, mark levin. [ applause ] and thanks all of you for coming, as well. that is all the time we have left this evening. as always, let not your heart be troubled. the news continues. see you become here soon on "hannity." stay tuned. fox news continues. tonight, did you trust your government? >> young americans do not trust this government. without trust in government, then you can't do a lot of things. >> what we have going on today is a real erosion of the confidence on behalf of the american public in terms of their trust in government and frankly the faith in their economy. >> the people can't trust not only the executive branch but also don't trust congress and don't trust federal judges, to make sure that we're abiding by the constitution, due process and rule of law then we're going to have some problems here. >> on the heels of the irs scandal, where people don't trust this government, this administration, with their tax
records, they sure don't trust this administration with their phone railroads. >> i want to make clear once again america is not interested in spying on ordinary people. >> there's nothing phony about an nsa program that almost failed on the house floor. >> according to data from pew majorities across all groups express little or no trust in washington. >> you need to have trust in government for the government to work effectively. >> good evening. perino. in the latest news about the nsa giving americans yet another reason to distrust our government, "the washington post" revealing that the nsa has broken privacy rules, thousands of times, every year since 2008. and the chief judge of the secret court that's supposed to police the government's spying program says that the court has limited ability to do its job. the nsa issuing this response, quote, when nsa makes a mistake and carrying out its foreign intelligence mission, the agency reports the issue internally and
to federal overseers and aggressively gets to the bottom of it. congressman goudi joins us. thank you for being here on a friday evening. let me ask you. when you first heard of this news last night, were you surprised or in line with what you thought was probably happening? >> well, dana, i would like to tell you i'm still surprised when government disappoints and when there's evidence we can't trust people in positions of power but i'm beyond that point. i was surprised at the pervas e pervasiveness of it. thousands of incidents. here's what does surprise me. i know having three branches of government is tedious sometimes. i know that that is disappointing to the executive branch. but i wonder how many of my colleagues in congress were briefed that there were thousands of errors made with respect to this program because i have a sneaking suspicion the number is zero. that's how many of my colleagues were told ahead of time before we had to learn from a leaker to a newspaper that there were
thousands of violations. >> so, i believe that congressman rogers office said they did see the memo are regular reports but if the nsa is doing trillions of searchless looking for a need until a haystack, is a couple of thousand violations that were pretty much computer generated not intended incidents by the intelligence community, do you think that in some way they could say, look, this is a computer generated problem, this is not our intent is to violate the law and get to the bottom of it when we see it? >> i think in a vacuum, you can make that argument but on the heels of benghazi and fast and furious and james rosen's scandal and this demonstrate in addition of trust that people have across all demographic groups, in government, no. it's not enough to say, well, there's human error involved. yes, in a vacuum, in a relationship grounded in trust, can you forgive episodic shortcomings?
yes. but right now, dana, people's image of government is not a blindfolded woman holding a set of scales. this is lowest learner invoking. that's what my children think of when they think of government. hiding and only admitting it once you're caught. that is not conducive with a trust relationship and if we don't get that figured out, i'm not worried about winning elections. i'm worried about the republic. if we don't get this figured out that people who are governed have con sended to be governed have to have trust in the people we have put in positions of responsibility, the fact that they report it to one another, what good does that do? and i'm happy that representative rogers knew about it. that's one of 435 members of the house. how about those of us who were not only intelligence community -- intelligence committee but we're asked home about this program and what are we supposed to say? >> i'm glad you brought that up
because you voted for the legislation that was put forward that would have adjusted the nsa funding to try to do something about what is perceived by some as privacy violations. since you have been home on the august break, are you hearing from people on this? they want this issue addressed? >> yes, ma'am. i'm hearing about it because i'm a former prosecutor who usually balances the scale towards public safety. i voted for the patriot act reauthorization. i heard about that when i came back home. in fact, i helped some of the leaders in congress convince colleagues a year ago to vote for the reauthorization. i'm not going to do it anymore because the author of the patriot act says it's used a way he never envisioned. had a town hall last night. if i had to tell you the dominant theme is people are
scared and distrustful. and that is across party lines, it's across ideological lines. they just don't trust government and we're not going to make it if we don't get that fixed. >> what do you think is the remedy coming back when congress comes back to town? do you think there's any way that congress could get together and do something and especially when the white house today which seems to comment on everything actually didn't comment on this "the washington post" report at all? >> you know, dana, we had attorney general mccasey who came and spoke to a group of us and i asked him a legal question which i thought was entirely appropriate talking about the fourth amendment. he held up a picture of the twin towers and said, do you want this again? well, you can do that with any issue. i mean, you can use that to justify reading people's e-mails if you want to. we have to have a conversation about how we have balance, public safety with privacy.
both are of constitutional significance. how we balance it. there's a belief that we have skewed the balance more towards public safety and away from privacy. the real complication is that we have asked people to prevent crime. not investigate crime after it happened like in boston. but we have asked them to prevent it. so you have that challenge along with balancing privacy and public safety and i think there's a growing mood in congress on both sides of the aisle that we have overskewed it towards public safety an away from privacy and very difficult for a former prosecutor to say but i believe it. and is there an opportunity to work on that when we get back? yes. justin's amendment almost passed. it didn't almost pass because people want to see the program go away but because members of congress feel they have no power over this program. imagine how the people that send us to d.c. feel. we don't think we have enough information and we're supposed to. so it's an opportunity to fix
it. >> is it fair to say then that you don't think that what president obama announced last week in the press conference about a new board to oversee this is going to be good enough for you? >> well, he's had a board that had 14 members and now it's down to 4. no, i'm not interested. we have one. it's called congress. >> right. >> called the leg lative branch. if you want an advisory board, we have one. so you will have to just stop letting a few people know what's going on with the intelligence programs but let everyone know and if you don't, then you're going to find some of these tools are not available anymore. >> sounds reasonable to me. thank you so much. it's becoming a habit. president obama trying to make an end run around congress. yet again. in june, president obama vowed to make climate change a priority of his second term and this week epa chief mccarthy saying that the president plans
to bypass congress to get that done. >> they do think that this climate change issue and its impacts are fundamentally an economic challenge. they are fundamentally an economic challenge and i think that the president recognizes that. he said that he wasn't going to wait for congress but that he had administrative authorities and it was time to start utilizing those more effectively in a more concerted way. >> it's not just climate change. president obama making his own plans to finance high-speed internet in schools telling the fcc to tack on a new tax to everyone's cell phone bills instead of asking congress for the money. congressman michael graham joins us. i was asking you, of all the examples of president obama going around congress, which one is most egregious. you said the new fcc idea. >> absolutely. it's so blatant. it is a flagrant, arrogant disregard, not just for the current congress.
look, it's not about me personally. that's not what this is about. you think about who's the congress? it really it is the voice of the people. he doesn't care what the people think. we saw that with obama care. it's irrelevant. he had an agenda and he's going to do whatever he has to do to pass that agenda regardless of the constitution. i think our founding faerls are turning over in the graves right now because he's so blatant and they're bold and brazen about saying, yeah, we're going to make an end run around congress. >> in some ways on the internet for schools, we are for that. i'm for more schools having that and i think president obama could make a persuasive case to congress to add about $5 per cell phone bill a year. not per month. i guess per year. but does president obama have a point that congress is so dysfunctional, they can't get anything passed and he has to do the good works on his own? >> absolutely not. first of all, you know, again, i have the military background so my leadership skills were reared
in the united states marine corps and first from my parents. leadership is about leading. the president hasn't led. of course the congress is polarized and not much is getting done. he works closely with the senate to block whatever we try to do in the house and he's a big part of the problem instead of the solution. what a real leader does, it's a difficult task but recognizing that, leadership rises above that. leadership brings the two groups together and tries get something done. i've never once been invited to the white house to talk about policy. you know? so where's he been a leader? >> have you been invited -- do you shmooze with anybody? president bush would invite them out. a cigar on the truman balcony. >> never once. when's funny about that, other than like the white house christmas party or the specific things, i've been to maybe two events at the white house, but the democrats, you know, offline, off record will say how disappointed they are in the house they're not invited to the
white house to sit with the president. >> not just for entertainment. in some ways president obama, you attract more bees with honey. >> well, of course. >> i think that there are definite things to get done in congress if the congressional relations were more smooth. >> the house of representatives is people. it's human nature to get things done with people you're working with. the congress, i think democrats agree with this, we don't feel that the president wants to work with us at all. and not once has he reached out to say, hey, come, let's sit down and break bread and talk about whatever. that just doesn't happen. so again, that's a lack of leadership. and that's a welcome of desire and personally, i really do believe because of political reasons it's more advantageous for the president to keep us divided to use the administra r administrators and people in charge to go around the congress to do an agenda he knows ultimately the people are not going to support. >> we have 30 seconds. as you've been home in august for the recess, when's the
general mood of people? frustrated? >> i would say extremely frustrated. my district unlike the rest of the country has super storm sandy issues so that's a big frustration and people wonder why is everything so stagnant and part of the reason is overregulation and a lot of uncertainty. no one knows where the country is headed. >> and the president going around the people they sent to do the work. >> exactly. i don't think that's a good president for the country and i don't think it's in line with the constitution. >> all right. thank you so much. >> thank you. now to the irs and new claims that the targeting scandal is far from over. the obama administration promised to end the targeting of conservative groups but an irs employee telling congress, screeners are still flagging applications from certain groups and congressman aaron shock on the ways and means committee joining us now. congressman, this is an issue that seems to come and go and actually never quite goes away. catch us up to speed on what's the latest.
>> well, dana, it's great to be with you and thank you for covering this. you're right. the illegal activity of the irs has not stopped despite repeated inquiries, despite repeated calls by the president that this would end. despite a new commissioner being appointed, daniel werfel. whose sole responsibility to clean up the act of the irs. and despite danny werfel coming before congress last month and telling us he was implementing 11 different reforms to stop this type of illegal behavior from happening. but we're now finding according to the irs's own agents they're targeting conservative groups by name and asking inappropriate questions. we just heard from the thomas moore society in chicago, representing a couple of pro-life groups, may of this year, after the investigation had begun, after the illegal
behavior was exposed, they were asking pro-life groups how much of their time pent in prayer, how much of their time spent outside of abortion clinics, thing that is are clearly illegal for the irs to ask determining the tax exempt status of any organization. >> when you talked to the irs commissioner danny werfel, do you get the sense that he thinks that that behavior is wrong or do you think that the irs thinks that these are the types of questions think need to ask to be able to do their jobs? >> well, i think that the irs agents are being directed by their supervisors. that's what they're telling us. to ask the illegal questions. danny werfel has told us that he believes this behavior is inappropriate. the president said, if in fact, the claims were true it would be outrageous. the claims are true. and it is outrageous. and despite his promise to the american people that it was going to stop, it hasn't. and i think now chairman dave camp did the right thing and
exposing this to the american people in hopes that the administration and the irs will finally do what it should be doing and stop illegally targeting the conservative leaning groups. i think there's a level of incompetence in the irs they can't stop their own illegal behavior. >> they're hoping that this issue will go away and that they won't have to talk about it anymore, that everybody will focus on something else when they come back or do you think -- >> i do. >> or the tea party groups are sufficiently upset and beating the drum and maybe come back and testify in front of your committee in september? >> well, we are going to keep investigating this and i would remind you that the only reason the american people are continuing to hear about this, the only reason that we know that the illegal targeting is continuing is because we have a republican controlled house. the democrats in the committee already said if they ran the place, the investigation would be complete. if the investigation were complete, we wouldn't know that
these conservative groups are continuing to be targeted, continuing to be asked illegal questions and this mess would never be cleaned up so thank goodness we have balance in power in washington, d.c. right now and have the investigations, subpoena the people that need to, compel them to come before congress and get to the bottom of what happened. we already know that the president claimed these were rogue agents in cincinnati. we determined that they weren't rogue agents in snaetd. they were all over regional offices. we know that there were people in washington, d.c. directing this kind of behavior. so, we have to get to the bottom of this. and we're going to do that on the ways and means committee. >> do i have it light that lois lerner is collecting a salary and not working since pleading the fifth? >> that's right. over $100,000 a year, not only collecting the pay but getting the retirement accrual. retirement ben filths and pension and federal health care and the benefit that is come with someone that shows up and
works 40 hours a week and not worked for two months. interesting thing, dana, is we have learned that just two weeks ago we learned that she was on e-mails as the head of the tax exempt status to the federal election commission asking for detailed information on financial giving of tax exempt applicants, completely violation of law. the irs cannot ask another agency whether it's the federal election commission or the epa or the department of labor information about tax paying citizens and when it's determine nating who to audit, who should get 301-3-c status and not whether they have troubles with another agency out there. to ask a political affiliation and giving political money to as the head of the tax exempt status is a violation of law and she wrote the e-mails and i
don't think she should be on administrative leave and getting paid. she should be under oath before congress and there's a reason now she's asking for immunity to cooperate. >> well, hopefully then that will help you get to the bottom of it. thank you so much. >> straight ahead -- >> good to be with you, day in. >> thank you. straight ahead, is obama care putting your privacy at risk? more than a dozen state's attorneys general are saying it is. attorney general pam bondi is here to talk about that next. also, health care battles. budget battles and the uncertainty taking a toll on businesses. you'llmall business panel coming up.
tonight new warnings that obama care could put your privacy in yepdy. states attorneys general saying the information could go public and taking the concerns to hhs. florida attorney general bondi joins us. attorney general, thank you for being here. i think the people are confused of who has an exchange and who doesn't have an exchange and the states and the navigators you think could cause a huge problem especially with privacy. >> dana, absolutely. and let me explain for -- patrick morrie sy, the great attorney general of west virginia brought this to our attention and identity theft as we know is rampant in our country and i could first just define what a navigator is. a navigator is someone who is hired by the federal government and they have already invested over $67 million in hiring these navigators.
navigators assist consumers who wish to enroll in insurance programs under the affordable care act. now, here's what's happening. because of time con stants and "wall street journal" reported this ten days ago, hhs is cutting back on the requirement to become a navigator. meaning, they're not doing background checks, they're not fingerprinting these people and it's more than navigators. it is people that assist the navigators. now, these navigators will have our consumers throughout the country's most personal and private information, tax return information, social security information. and our biggest fear, of course, is identity theft. even, dana, federal requirements now for census takers, even state requirements are so much tougher than the requirements for these navigators so we've sent a letter to hhs asking by
august 28th for them to respond to us and tell them because we have extremely -- we have many, many grave concerns over the numerous deficiencies in what's happening. in fact, they have cut even the training for these navigators from 30 hours down to 20 hours. >> and so when hhs gets a letter like this, i would imagine they're just overwhelmed with how many people are complaining about different parts of it. but attorney general, they had -- kathleen sebelius diverted the money for disease prevention to the navigators. do you think that they have any sort of concern about the money that it was supposed to go to actual care like disease prevention to then going to bureaucrat who is are going to get your private information and then using computers that may or may not be secure enough to protect it from the public's hands. >> and dana, that's our exact
concern. that they have invested $67 million of our tax dollars to go to these navigators that haven't received adequate training. they're not committed to fingerprints on them, background checks. we don't know if they're a criminal. what if they've been convicted of committing identity theft or grand theft before? they could become a navigator. we need questions answered an enwho's monitoring these navigators. when's going to police the navigators? we have no answer to that. we need to know who's going to notice our consumers that this is happening, that when they give up their personal information they have no safeguards. we need to know who's liable if someone's identify is stolen. we want to know who educates them on fraud prevention. there are so many issues out there, dana, still unanswered and our consumer vs to know
this. this isn't a political issue. this is an issue about protecting our consumers and our -- their identity from unscrupulous people and we know they're out there all over our country. >> it's interesting that there's so much concern about the nsa program expressed by people of the phone records looked at by the government. i think my health records to me personally are more of a concern. i heard there's one insurance company that was requiring your bmi to be listed. i don't want anybody to know about that. >> that's right. >> would you support a delay, congressman marcia blackburn in the house, she has a bill she's sponsoring that would be a one-year delay. would you support that? could you get behind something like that or do you think that's not worth going down? >> well, let me tell you. we have to have answers from kathleen sebelius and asked her for that very reason because we have to have safeguards in
effect. our jobs as attorneys general throughout the country to protect our consumers in our states and that's why it's so very, very important that if someone's going to give, like you said, all their personal health information, social security number, tax information, it makes it so easy for an unscrupulous person to steal your identity. and that's what we care about. we need the see what the answers are. they have obviously invested multimillions of dollars in to these navigators. we need to them trained. an excuse is not acceptable. it's not acceptable to say, well, we're running out of time and let the people come in here and have all of your private information. consumers deserve better and this country deserves better and hopefully they listen to us. >> plus there could be a computer error along the way. attorney general, thank you so much. >> exactly. thank you. okay. coming up, small businesses struggling to stay afloat as
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when people come together, good things happen. to learn more, visit coke.com/comingtogether the president's economic approval rating plunged to just 35%. american businesses struggling to survive amid reams of new regulations, high corporate tax rates and constant uncertainty about obama care. what's worrying small business owners the most? joining us are three small business owners across america. mike bray owner of hobby works. harold jackson owner of buffalo supply. matthew smamalia owner of smaglia productions. harold, tell us about your business and how recent conditions out of washington have been affecting it.
>> well, buffalo supplies a family business. we're 30 years old. we're a distributor of high-tech medical equipment. and it's always a struggle to keep up with the new regulations coming out. you know, it is our goal to always comply with every rule, law and regulation but it's full-time job trying to keep up with them. >> interesting because one of the things i read in your notes was that the medical device tax provision of obama care which is actually been voted 79-0 to be repealed by the united states senate and an amazing bipartisan achievement and especially in today's washington. how's that affecting your business in particular? >> it doesn't directly impact me because i'm a distributor. i don't have to pay the tax. it indirectly affects me because the suppliers have to raise their prices to cover the tax and in some cases we get put in a short squeeze where we have contracts with our customers that take time to change.
and escalating prices negatively impact us. >> okay. let me now go to mike because you're there in washington, d.c. which is also a place i spent a lot of time and half home state advantage goes to you. you actually think -- your business is doing fairly, well? you're intending to be able to grow this year. >> that's correct. the worst part of the recession seemed for us to kind of have petered out in the middle of 2011 and so from the first half of 2011 to the near the end of 2012, we were really going back gang busters. that was one of the best 12-month stretches we have ever had. we've seen saw weakness at the end of 2012 and the first half of the year hasn't been great, but i feel like that the second half of this year is going to improve and we are looking forward to opening one or two locations next year. >> does obama care and the new regulations and providing
employees with what the government requires and what you want to provide as an employer having an impact at all? >> we live in maryland, dana and my business head quartered in maryland and maryland is ahead of other states in terms of being ready for some of these provisions and as a result i'm going to be better off. we already provide health care for our employees. we're right at 50 employees right now. but maryland, where i only had three choices for health care before, 13 insurers announced intention to provide on maryland exchange. hopefully with new businesses an individuals online as potential customers and nearly quadruple the potential, you know, competition amongst insurers, i might be in good shape. >> maryland was one of the first to actually adopt an exchange. other states have not had the same kind of experience and people haven't. matthew, a thing you noted was that your premiums for your health care insurance have gone
up an incredible 96%. how are you dealing with that as a small business owner? >> it's very difficult. i mean, it's one of the things that we're also dealing with is the fact that medium-sized businesses to hire my company holding on to their cash so they're not going out an they're not spending the money that we need in order to stimulate our economy so that i can provide more jobs to people. >> so what do you think, matthew, that washington, d.c. if anything would it be good for them to actually do something or do you just wish they would stop doing things? >> as a small business owner and one of the great things about our country is we get to make a business and follow a dream and starting to turn around and have washington tell us, hey, we think that you should run the small business in this way, it sort of deflates your enthusiasm a little bit. >> harold, one of your concerns is government spending and we had thisuester in place last march and it didn't have the
disastrous effects president obama said it was going to have but it's squeezed different plays and one of the things you provide equipment to is veterans hospitals. are you concerned that when they come back and washington can't get anything done, that's going to be an even greater worry for your business? >> well, yes, i am. the sequester didn't affect us deeply. it did impact our department of defense business in a negative way. but that seemed to be offset with growth in the department of veteran affairs which, of course, was not included as part of the sequester. but if you have a government shutdown, it would certainly have a negative impact on our business. >> mike, what are you hearing from employees or people applying to work at hobby works? do they have anxiety or do you think that their mood is improving as the economy improves in certain areas? >> well, you know, i think the
mood right now is very uncertain. it was real positive going in to the second half of 2012, but the talk of the budget cuts and the sequester that followed and then the payroll, letting the payroll tax cuts expire so that money started coming out of basically lower middle and middle income workers' paychecks, that's really i think had a chilling effect and everybody it seems to me, nobody needs anything we sell so it seems to me that both potential employees and my discuss merles are kind of in a holding pattern waiting to see what's going to come next. >> i don't know if people don't need them but i want them. i like the things on the screen. gentlemen, thank you so much. very helpful for america to hear from you. the death toll rising in egypt after clashes of the military and the muslim brotherhood. the crisis is only getting worse. should the obama administration be doing smrsome we'll discuss.
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live from america's news headquarters, a wind driven wild fire in idaho driving people out of their homes tonight. the sheriff's department issuing a mandatory evacuation order. more than 600 firefighters are battling the 100-square mile beaver creek fire. the flames are threatening the posh sun valley ski resort, a second home to many hollywood celebrities. in egypt, e mains a scene of chaos. 82 people and 10 police officers were killed today in a round of violence. vigilantes traded gun fire with protesters. it began wednesday with the gft's crackdown of supporters of ousted president morsi. the death toll climbed past 700 and little hope that calm will return any time soon. now back to "on the record."
a day of rage in egypt. tens of thousands of muslim brotherhood supporters storming the streets defying a military imposed state of emergency. the clashes follow yesterday's crackdown killing supporters of ousted president morsi. president obama condemned the violence and canceled a planned joint military operation with egypt. should the u.s. be doing more? rick ranelle, a former colleague of mine, joins us from los angeles. rick, i always trusted your judgment on these. you have a measured view of foreign policy. yesterday do you think that president obama struck the right tone for what we have to do now as america involved in egypt? >> well, first of all, i have to say i'm nervous of being interviewed of my former boss. i'm used to briefing you.
let me give it a try. i actually think that president obama was quite good this week. i thought he was very measured. we right now do not need to come down on the current government, the military government, too much. we have to remember when we have chaos all around us right now that the u.s. interest is really to have a government that's not islamist. and when we had the morsi government in place, i felt like the obama administration wasn't tough enough. that would have been the time to kind of hold back some of the funds that were coming from congress and yet we didn't. so if we're not going to hold back the funds for an islamist government, we should not hold back the funds for a military government that's looking to have stability and peace. >> but when you -- as you were mentioning, so behind the scenes, the obama administration state department and others, probably cia, were urging the
generals that are in charge now of the government in egypt to exercise caution, to not erupt but that didn't happen. and now you have over 635 people that have been killed by their own government. i mean, how do you then work that back if they wouldn't listen to us before the violence? >> well, certainly, we have to be very clear that the -- any violence is absolutely wrong and that we condemn it. and that we don't want to be put in to the situation where we're somehow glossing over what the military government is doing right now. we want to stand firm against that. but you're right to suggest, we don't have a lot of influence. i would suggest that if the obama administration would have pulled back some of the funding when we had an islamist government with morsi in charge that we would have had a little more credibility now to kind of say, hey, listen to us. but clearly, our influence is
waynie i waning but need to maintain a seat at the table as small as that seat is right now. egypt is very important for the united states. it is our bridge in to that region and it's a great ally of the united states so we need to remember that we need to keep them close and do everything we can to try to have as much influence as possible. >> politically, i wanted to ask you about the criticism of the obama administration's response from the left. i'll just read you four things i wrote down. i read incoherent, not tough enough, that they were come police it in the violence and alienated every faction in egypt and that's coming from people that traditionally would support president obama. >> i would add to that they're too late. all of those criticisms are right but they could have been saying that, you know, years ago. i mean, just look at the syria policy. we sent back our ambassador in to chaos, no the damascus. pulled him back to washington.
sent him back to damascus again. we have had an incoherent policy throughout all of the middle east and remember the obama administration only produced one resolution on iran at the u.n. so we haven't had a lot of influence from this administration. i think the obama team has just decided that they would rather be hop lar than try to push through a lot of these difficult issues but again i want to go back to what president obama said this week in mar that's vineyard i thought was very good because he didn't take the bait on immediately siding with the islamist government like he had done before. >> i agree. all right. rick, thank you so much. >> any time, dana. straight ahead, it is not the wiener mobile you're used to seeing and you may want to keep your kids away from this one. that's next. the ones getting involved and staying engaged. they're not afraid to question the path they're on.
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